Boost Pressure? - Chevy Colorado & GMC Canyon
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post #1 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-17-2017, 08:56 AM Thread Starter
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Boost Pressure Discussion (stock turbo)

So I have been watching boost pressure for some time. I have been tuned the whole time with Duramaxtuner and before the delete could see spikes as high as 35-36 psi on the OBD Fusion app reading from the OBDII port. I have since installed an aftermarket gauge and have confirmed they reading are pretty consistent with each other.

So yesterday I was playing around, now fully deleted with a turbo back exhaust and can get the boost to go as high as 45psi (which is where my gauge ends) under certain conditions. Conditions have to be low rpms in a high gear and rolling into the throttle enough to put as much load on the engine without down shifting.

Here are two videos:

https://youtu.be/sSj38XWtaz0

https://youtu.be/zrcJB-rhokw

This is a video pre-delete, same tune (supposed to be, just had the current tune with the delete parameters implemented):

https://youtu.be/gsXYMgQz4mo

I'll try and grab a similar video so the last one posted for comparison

What is everyone else seeing that are able to monitor boost?

2016 Colorado LT Diesel
Red Rock, Sports bar, Black 5" assist steps, EGT and Boost Gauge with custom bezel mount
AFE Magnum Intake and Bladerunner Hot/Cold side Kit
Duramaxtune DSP-4 Tuning
AFE Rebel side exit turbo back w/ Black tips



Last edited by mrpositraction; 05-17-2017 at 09:05 AM. Reason: Changed title
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post #2 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-17-2017, 08:59 AM Thread Starter
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Here is an image from the OBDII Fusion app showing where the boost max'd during a WOT blast:


2016 Colorado LT Diesel
Red Rock, Sports bar, Black 5" assist steps, EGT and Boost Gauge with custom bezel mount
AFE Magnum Intake and Bladerunner Hot/Cold side Kit
Duramaxtune DSP-4 Tuning
AFE Rebel side exit turbo back w/ Black tips


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post #3 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-17-2017, 09:44 AM
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No wonder those flimsy stock hoses bulge out and sometimes leak. Been toying with the idea of replacing them. A site like these guys should be a good place get the parts.

HPS - Manufacturer of High Temp Reinforced Performance Silicone Hoses , Aluminum Tubing & Stainless Steel Clamps
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post #4 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-17-2017, 10:59 AM
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Originally Posted by mrpositraction View Post
So I have been watching boost pressure for some time. I have been tuned the whole time with Duramaxtuner and before the delete could see spikes as high as 35-36 psi on the OBD Fusion app reading from the OBDII port. I have since installed an aftermarket gauge and have confirmed they reading are pretty consistent with each other.


You say that Fusion and the gauge read the same but did you not have Fusion running when you did the 40-45psi tests? Should that not have confirmed the same numbers?
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post #5 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-17-2017, 12:17 PM Thread Starter
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You say that Fusion and the gauge read the same but did you not have Fusion running when you did the 40-45psi tests? Should that not have confirmed the same numbers?
I'll have to redo the test, I can't record and run Fusion :)

Good idea, but I don't really doubt the numbers, I think they are good numbers for Pre-intercooler. I am slightly concerned that I could be overboosting/spinning the turbo since the Delete.

2016 Colorado LT Diesel
Red Rock, Sports bar, Black 5" assist steps, EGT and Boost Gauge with custom bezel mount
AFE Magnum Intake and Bladerunner Hot/Cold side Kit
Duramaxtune DSP-4 Tuning
AFE Rebel side exit turbo back w/ Black tips


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post #6 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-17-2017, 12:28 PM Thread Starter
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I did talk to Duramaxtuner, they couldn't really confirm there is an issue since I am readying pre-intercooler. They did state however that I shouldn't be seeing above low 30's at the intake/ODB reading.

2016 Colorado LT Diesel
Red Rock, Sports bar, Black 5" assist steps, EGT and Boost Gauge with custom bezel mount
AFE Magnum Intake and Bladerunner Hot/Cold side Kit
Duramaxtune DSP-4 Tuning
AFE Rebel side exit turbo back w/ Black tips


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post #7 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-17-2017, 01:07 PM Thread Starter
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Stock sensor isn't reading anything over 29 psi regardless of how much boost I show. I bought the adapter piece I needed to relocate to post intercooler/pre TB but I wonder if I am leaking through the EGR......gping to have t9 rem9ve that sooner than later.

2016 Colorado LT Diesel
Red Rock, Sports bar, Black 5" assist steps, EGT and Boost Gauge with custom bezel mount
AFE Magnum Intake and Bladerunner Hot/Cold side Kit
Duramaxtune DSP-4 Tuning
AFE Rebel side exit turbo back w/ Black tips


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post #8 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-17-2017, 02:06 PM
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Originally Posted by mrpositraction View Post
I did talk to Duramaxtuner, they couldn't really confirm there is an issue since I am readying pre-intercooler. They did state however that I shouldn't be seeing above low 30's at the intake/ODB reading.
That's about what I typically see.

I'm curious though, since your on the early MotorOps tune that I think doesn't account for the EGR being off which can cause boost spikes. What PSI are you seeing at idle?

Turn on Commanded boost A and see if at idle boost over 14.7 is being requested
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post #9 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-17-2017, 11:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Duken4evr View Post
No wonder those flimsy stock hoses bulge out and sometimes leak. Been toying with the idea of replacing them. A site like these guys should be a good place get the parts.
For real. That's the reason I want to replace my pipes. The OEM's are weak.

I'm going either Profab or AFE.

Mike
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post #10 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-18-2017, 06:28 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by lqdchkn View Post
That's about what I typically see.

I'm curious though, since your on the early MotorOps tune that I think doesn't account for the EGR being off which can cause boost spikes. What PSI are you seeing at idle?

Turn on Commanded boost A and see if at idle boost over 14.7 is being requested
Yes, it appears to be calling for around 15psi at idle.

I also switched the location where i am measuring boost now on the COLD side, I can still get as high as 40 psi, obd fusion reading 29 psi max, like it can't go past that.

2016 Colorado LT Diesel
Red Rock, Sports bar, Black 5" assist steps, EGT and Boost Gauge with custom bezel mount
AFE Magnum Intake and Bladerunner Hot/Cold side Kit
Duramaxtune DSP-4 Tuning
AFE Rebel side exit turbo back w/ Black tips


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post #11 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-18-2017, 07:17 AM
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You should try and find a compressor map for that turbo, but I can about guarantee that you were way over speeding it. That results in high EGT' s, high IATs, and exceeds the limits of the turbo' s bearings.
Is it any wonder that GM automatically voids warranty for tuned trucks?
I know it's taking a long time, but I would only considere the GDE tune for the above reasons.
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post #12 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-18-2017, 08:37 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Suns_PSD View Post
You should try and find a compressor map for that turbo, but I can about guarantee that you were way over speeding it. That results in high EGT' s, high IATs, and exceeds the limits of the turbo' s bearings.
Is it any wonder that GM automatically voids warranty for tuned trucks?
I know it's taking a long time, but I would only considere the GDE tune for the above reasons.
Your making a lot of assumptions and speculations. One thing, if the EGR is leaking through, and the MAP sensor is reaching a point to where the computer isn't asked to intervene to throttle back the guide vane than regardless of who tunes is you are going to see the same problem. Short of me having a bad EGR system, everyone is likely to see these issues over time if we are pushing past the EGR.

Honestly, I am tired of hearing about GDE, they are the unicorn of tunes. When they come out, and are readily available, there is a good chance I will try them, I usually try all sort of tunes and tuners with my different vehicles. But "waiting for the next best thing", you might as well wait for the next generation truck as it is undoubtedly going to be better than this one, or the next one. While you are waiting I am enjoying the power and mpg of my tune, and now the reliability of having the emissions removed.

You sit on the side lines and wait while the rest of us help pave the way for an aftermarket market with these trucks. We don't mind, honestly, we do it for ourselves as we enjoy turning wrenches and tweaking to get that little bit more out of something that is already not that bad.
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2016 Colorado LT Diesel
Red Rock, Sports bar, Black 5" assist steps, EGT and Boost Gauge with custom bezel mount
AFE Magnum Intake and Bladerunner Hot/Cold side Kit
Duramaxtune DSP-4 Tuning
AFE Rebel side exit turbo back w/ Black tips


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post #13 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-18-2017, 09:53 AM
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Your point is valid about waiting for GDE. If I had my '18 Denali in my hands, not sure I'd be waiting any longer either!


I don't know tons about these modern computer programs but what your saying, I don't feel is the cause of the over-boost situation.


The reality is that 99% of tuners shut off some codes, advance the timing and add pw to make the power. Sure they play with other things such as turbo vanes but it's not a surprise that since they don't monitor turbo speeds (like GDE does) and that since all the exhaust restriction has been removed, that you have a turbo over-speeding. They know that the manufacturers build a lot of safety factor in to these vehicles so they can afford, most of the time to over-speed the turbo a bit and run the egts too hot.


GDE has a totally different approach and this is why they are my only serious consideration for tuning. They have not released their tuning because the software available does not have the ability to alter pilot injections and other things that they manipulate. GDE focuses on reduction of C0 output (that's mpg) within the published safety factors (Cylinder Pressures, turbo speeds, egts) of the components being used. This also has the net effect of extending the lifespan of the OEM emissions equipment to beyond the useful life of the vehicle itself. They essentially do exactly what they do for the OEMs, but with a different set of priorities that consumers demand.


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post #14 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-18-2017, 10:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Suns_PSD View Post

GDE has a totally different approach and this is why they are my only serious consideration for tuning. They have not released their tuning because the software available does not have the ability to alter pilot injections and other things that they manipulate.
Really? No other software has the ability to alter pilot injection?

What are these tables for then, I wonder?

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post #15 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-19-2017, 10:50 AM Thread Starter
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Had a great conversation today with Motor Ops. We talked through what I was seeing and I believe I am good! They are seeing 38-42psi with the deleted trucks. The 29psi I am seeing on the MAP sensor is correct as they don't go above that. The EGT that I am seeing sound correct to them(though on the REALLY GOOD END).

One suggestion he did state is to put the stock EGT sensor back in as it does use that reading still and could cause drivability issues.

One thing, can anyone with EFI Live confirm we have a MAF that gives the computer the Air Flow rate?
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2016 Colorado LT Diesel
Red Rock, Sports bar, Black 5" assist steps, EGT and Boost Gauge with custom bezel mount
AFE Magnum Intake and Bladerunner Hot/Cold side Kit
Duramaxtune DSP-4 Tuning
AFE Rebel side exit turbo back w/ Black tips


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post #16 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-19-2017, 11:51 AM
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Originally Posted by mrpositraction View Post
Had a great conversation today with Motor Ops. We talked through what I was seeing and I believe I am good! They are seeing 38-42psi with the deleted trucks. The 29psi I am seeing on the MAP sensor is correct as they don't go above that. The EGT that I am seeing sound correct to them(though on the REALLY GOOD END).

One suggestion he did state is to put the stock EGT sensor back in as it does use that reading still and could cause drivability issues.

One thing, can anyone with EFI Live confirm we have a MAF that gives the computer the Air Flow rate?
Yes the manual describes it as "The mass air flow (MAF) sensor"
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post #17 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-19-2017, 12:17 PM Thread Starter
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Yes the manual describes it as "The mass air flow (MAF) sensor"
Thanks for the colorful response. Is the ECM using it as an air flow sensor or a temperature sensor? Ford would use the same sensor and sometimes only use it for temperatures (no longer used IAT sensors), being unfamiliar with GM (this is my first) and GM having MAP sensors for the most part, how do they use the MAF sensor?
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2016 Colorado LT Diesel
Red Rock, Sports bar, Black 5" assist steps, EGT and Boost Gauge with custom bezel mount
AFE Magnum Intake and Bladerunner Hot/Cold side Kit
Duramaxtune DSP-4 Tuning
AFE Rebel side exit turbo back w/ Black tips


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post #18 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-19-2017, 12:19 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by mrpositraction View Post
Thanks for the colorful response. Is the ECM using it as an air flow sensor or a temperature sensor? Ford would use the same sensor and sometimes only use it for temperatures (no longer used IAT sensors), being unfamiliar with GM (this is my first) and GM having MAP sensors for the most part, how do they use the MAF sensor?

Let me get straight to why I am asking. Was trying to confirm something Motor Ops stated without just putting it out there. They claim to be getting the air flow reading to adjust fuel from the MAF sensor as the MAP sensor doesn't read above 29psi. I wanted to confirm this.
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2016 Colorado LT Diesel
Red Rock, Sports bar, Black 5" assist steps, EGT and Boost Gauge with custom bezel mount
AFE Magnum Intake and Bladerunner Hot/Cold side Kit
Duramaxtune DSP-4 Tuning
AFE Rebel side exit turbo back w/ Black tips


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post #19 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-20-2017, 12:33 AM
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Let me get straight to why I am asking. Was trying to confirm something Motor Ops stated without just putting it out there. They claim to be getting the air flow reading to adjust fuel from the MAF sensor as the MAP sensor doesn't read above 29psi. I wanted to confirm this.
I'm not sure I follow what they are doing because I'm pretty sure you need both.

MAF reads flow rate and temp of air coming into the engine so it can calculate oxygen content in order to know how much fuel to use.

I think the MAP comes into play for timing as more boost sould require a change in injection timing.

@hacklerjason Is this right?
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post #20 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-20-2017, 12:48 AM
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Originally Posted by mrpositraction View Post
Thanks for the colorful response. Is the ECM using it as an air flow sensor or a temperature sensor? Ford would use the same sensor and sometimes only use it for temperatures (no longer used IAT sensors), being unfamiliar with GM (this is my first) and GM having MAP sensors for the most part, how do they use the MAF sensor?
It's both actually... It's a mass airflow/temp/humidity

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